https://www.adbusters.org/magazine/85/delusion-revolution.html

in part:

We are told that it is “realistic” to yield to the absurd idea that the systems we live in are the only systems possible or acceptable based on the fact that some people like them and wish them to continue. But what if our current level of first world consumption is exhausting the ecological basis for life? Too bad. The only “realistic” options are those that view this lifestyle as nonnegotiable. What if real democracy is not possible in a nation-state with 300 million people? Too bad. The only “realistic” options are those that view this way of organizing a polity as immutable. What if the hierarchies our lives are based on are producing extreme material deprivation for the oppressed and dull misery among the privileged? Too bad. The only “realistic” options are those that view hierarchy as inevitable.

Let me offer a different view of reality:

(1) We live in a system that, taken as a whole, is unsustainable – not only over the long haul but in the short term.

(2) Unsustainable systems cannot be sustained.

How’s that for a profound theoretical insight? Unsustainable systems can’t be sustained. It’s hard to argue with that. The important question is whether or not we live in a system that is truly unsustainable. There’s no way to definitively prove such a sweeping statement, but look around at what we’ve built and ask yourself whether you really believe this world can go forward indefinitely … or even for more than a few decades. Take a minute to ponder the end of cheap fossil energy, the lack of viable large-scale replacements for that energy and the ecological consequences of burning what remains of it. Consider the indicators of the health of the planet: groundwater contamination, topsoil loss, levels of toxicity. Factor in the widening inequality in the world, the intensity of the violence and the desperation that so many feel at every level of society.

Based on what you know about these trends, do you think this is a sustainable system? If you were to let go of your attachment to this world, is there any way to imagine this as a sustainable system? Considering all the ways you understand the world, is there anything in your field of perception that tells you we’re on the right track?

duh.

What tats said.

just seeding some adbusters propaganda…

yeah, sorry.

the choir will shut up now.

(1) We live in a system that, taken as a whole, is unsustainable – not only over the long haul but in the short term.

(2) Unsustainable systems cannot be sustained.

I could be argued that everything is temporary and it’s only a matter of time..And then it could be argued that time is a construct of the human mind..that there is only an illusion of future and past only the eternal now..things are not sustained..always in state of construction and deconstruction..

richey - 07 August 2009 03:48 PM

(1) We live in a system that, taken as a whole, is unsustainable – not only over the long haul but in the short term.

(2) Unsustainable systems cannot be sustained.

I could be argued that everything is temporary and it’s only a matter of time..And then it could be argued that time is a construct of the human mind..that there is only an illusion of future and past only the eternal now..things are not sustained..always in state of construction and deconstruction..

Ummm, right… except that we arent discussing metaphysics—we are discussing the ‘sustainability’ (look it up if you are in doubt) of our economic/environmental systems. As in, if we continue to flush our raw sewage into the water supply, our grandchildren will have no clean water. That is, by definition, not sustainable. It can not be sustained.

Of course, if you think you can argue theoretical metaphysics without any clean water or food, feel free…

but your post is completely moronic..i hope you have never bred.

tatuaje - 07 August 2009 03:47 PM

yeah, sorry.

the choir will shut up now.

no. your original response was the same as mine when i read it. But the article makes some good points i thought might be of potential value to some…

It is kind of like the Titanic headed for the iceberg. The first mate sees it and calls the alarm, but the captain is zonked out below decks from too much partying. The passengers are largely oblivious. It takes a really long time to change course with such a huge vessel and only the captain can give the order. Will the Titanic hit the iceberg and sink, drowning most of the oblivious passengers or will they steer away in time and save the ship?

Stay tuned. Your life depends on it.

yeah, the example the author uses is a train…

Imagine you are riding comfortably on a sleek train. You look out the window and see that the tracks end abruptly not too far ahead ... The train will derail if it continues. You suggest the train stop immediately and the passengers go forward on foot. This will require a major shift in everyone’s way of traveling, of course, but you see it as the only realistic option. To continue barreling forward is to court catastrophic consequences. But when you propose this course of action, others – who have grown comfortable riding on the train – say, “We like the train, and arguing that we should get off is not realistic.”

In the contemporary United States, we are trapped in a similar delusion. We are told that it is “realistic” to yield to the absurd idea that the systems we live in are the only systems possible or acceptable based on the fact that some people like them and wish them to continue. But what if our current level of first world consumption is exhausting the ecological basis for life? Too bad. The only “realistic” options are those that view this lifestyle as nonnegotiable. What if real democracy is not possible in a nation-state with 300 million people? Too bad. The only “realistic” options are those that view this way of organizing a polity as immutable.

What if the hierarchies our lives are based on are producing extreme material deprivation for the oppressed and dull misery among the privileged? Too bad. The only “realistic” options are those that view hierarchy as inevitable.

but your post is completely moronic..i hope you have never bred.

Know..I haven’t bred.. no plan to..

About the metaphysics thing..Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, have used similar arguments about things being transitory to cushion the blow of living in a violent, chaotic,unsustainable world….

I could be argued that everything is temporary and it’s only a matter of time..And then it could be argued that time is a construct of the human mind..that there is only an illusion of future and past only the eternal now..things are not sustained..always in state of construction and deconstruction..

Billions of people use this kind of thinking in order to not face the horrors the temporary and unsustainability of this life..

I had a talk with an actual rocket scientist from Nasa one night over a bottle of Merlot..

He basically said the following about the sustainability of humans on earth,,

“It’s over ..nothing to do..the motions that are set in place can’t be undone..”

He said everone at Nasa knows this to be true..and the only reason this information is not deciminated is cause the folks that are partying wouldn’t have folks to bring them their shrimp baskets..we might as well party hardy, cause plugging up holes in this ship won’t work..

I’m not in agreement with this thinking..L Ron Hubard thought it was a done deal..

One of the purposes of Scientology is to get humanity to the point where we are ethereal operating thetans that don’t need bodies or our earth to sustain existence..

It makes ya wonder if this might not be true..the following makes me think it is true..
Many people in the know act like there’s no tomorrow..

1.GW Bush was our President..do think if anybody really gave a rats ass we’d have given him the job?

2.Our politicians don’t give a rats ass..Sanford takes off to Argentina when ever he feels like it..do think he really cared whether he got caught? Party on!!!

And another thing Piffy..just cause the thread doesn’t go the way you (in your amazing intelligence) want ..doesn’t mean it doesn’t have merit..you sound like a totalitarian NAZI when
you reduce your self to insults and name calling..although I enjoy doing it..it doesn’t wear well on you..

He basically said the following about the sustainability of humans on earth,,

“It’s over ..nothing to do..the motions that are set in place can’t be undone..”

There is a difference between life on this planet, including human life and human civilization as we know it.

There is a difference between life on this planet, including human life and human civilization as we know it.

What is it?

Chaos and the collapse of civilization followed by massive depopulation in which small pockets of indigenous peoples who know how to live off the land survive.

I had a talk with an actual rocket scientist from Nasa one night over a bottle of Merlot..

He basically said the following about the sustainability of humans on earth,,

“It’s over ..nothing to do..the motions that are set in place can’t be undone..”

He said everyone at Nasa knows this to be true..and the only reason this information is not desiminated is cause the folks that are partying wouldn’t have folks to bring them their shrimp baskets..we might as well party hardy, cause plugging up holes in this ship won’t work..

Yes I’m quoting myself..

I was just thinking..Nasa hasn’t done squat since we went to the moon..we are spending money like there is no tomorrow, people continue to pollute and use up resources like we don’t give a rats ass about tomorrow.

I guess I had better learn to bake a Kudzo Pie..