Well, no.
But could you imagine the field day people would have if this had happened? Now imagine someone having shouted “Allahu Akbar!” before killing 13. What would the media’s reaction to that be?
*crickets*
There is evidence that Hassan, a devout Muslim, was quite pissed about the wars in the Middle East and was dead set against going there as part of his service. But does that mean his religion was a motivating factor in his killing spree?
Chris Matthews says we may never know (and some tool from CAIR, the Islamic equivalent to the Catholic League, agree with him):
Now it’s come to light that he attempted to contact al Qaeda prior to the shootings. Now is it ok to speculate that he went on a rampage in the name of Allah?
The overall question I’m asking is: Does the media, bloggers included, have a double standard when it comes to religious motivations for crime? They knew this guys background within 12 hours of the killings, but it seemed verboten to even mention his religion as motivation even then.
What say you?
I don’t have time right now to get in depth with this, but I will say one thing (and post a link).
If he had said ‘God Bless Us.’ (or your example) would we be right in blaming christianity? Do you actually think people would blame that religion or condemn the rest of its followers? Because I don’t remember the entire christian religion being blamed when that abortion doctor was shot not so long ago even though the perp was clearly motivated by his religious beliefs.
I didn’t get the impression that it was so much a matter of his faith as it was a matter of him not being able to deal with being harassed about being of Middle Eastern descent and him not really wanting to go to war in Iraq. I’m sure his faith was a factor, but I think being crazy and not-suited for military service was probably a much bigger one.
I mean, I assume that our troops regularly pray before going out on mission, yet most people don’t see our side of the conflict as being a holy war or anything.
That said, even if he was mercilessly taunted every day for being Middle Eastern or Muslim, I don’t sympathize at all with this guy. If he didn’t want to go to war, he shouldn’t have joined the military. Going where they tell you to go and doing what they tell you to do is part of the deal. Another part of the deal is going into a culture that is notorious for being generally intolerant of any form of non-conformity. He seemed perfectly willing to take the military’s money, though. If he didn’t want to go, he had plenty of other options other than killing a bunch of people. Being an insane murderer doesn’t make you a Jihadist, though.
This is the cost of war. We send people off to do terrible things, to witness terrible things, and then when they come home we expect that they should just go on and be “normal” and if they can’t we pump them full of drugs offer them therapy and expect that that will undo all the damage. We can frame this as a religious thing if you want, but that just makes it easier to miss the obvious: killing one another has a cost, a cost that is not recoverable…and one we don’t seem willing to address.
If he had said ‘God Bless Us.’ (or your example) would we be right in blaming christianity? Do you actually think people would blame that religion or condemn the rest of its followers? Because I don’t remember the entire christian religion being blamed when that abortion doctor was shot not so long ago even though the perp was clearly motivated by his religious beliefs.
A couple of points: No, most people didn’t blame Christianity as a whole, but they certainly attacked the fundamentalist segment that is openly hostile to abortion practitioners, just as I blame the fundamentalist Islamic sect that advocates killing infidels and beating women. And I don’t think that’s wrong.
But that wasn’t really my point. I’m asking if the media and others are guilty of tip-toeing around the idea in the interest of not offending Muslims and if they would be so PC if the perp was a hardcore Christian.
This is the cost of war. We send people off to do terrible things, to witness terrible things, and then when they come home we expect that they should just go on and be “normal” and if they can’t we pump them full of drugs offer them therapy and expect that that will undo all the damage. We can frame this as a religious thing if you want, but that just makes it easier to miss the obvious: killing one another has a cost, a cost that is not recoverable…and one we don’t seem willing to address.
Yeah, but this guy was never in the Middle East and never saw combat. He was a psychiatrist. It’s not PTSD, so that kinda flushes that theory down the shitter.
Religion, regardless of name, gives the opportunity to remove culpability from ones self. No matter if the action is done in the name of Jesus, Allah, or Frank. To say that religion A is more guilty of this than religion B misses the point, and denies a whole lot of historical examples that prove otherwise.
This is the cost of war. We send people off to do terrible things, to witness terrible things, and then when they come home we expect that they should just go on and be “normal” and if they can’t we pump them full of drugs offer them therapy and expect that that will undo all the damage. We can frame this as a religious thing if you want, but that just makes it easier to miss the obvious: killing one another has a cost, a cost that is not recoverable…and one we don’t seem willing to address.
Yeah, but this guy was never in the Middle East and never saw combat. He was a psychiatrist. It’s not PTSD, so that kinda flushes that theory down the shitter.
Come on guys, isn’t it obvious he was doing this in the name of his religion? I’m not trying to attack Islam as a whole, I’m wondering if the media would have been so careful to not mention it if the situation were different.
Come on guys, isn’t it obvious he was doing this in the name of his religion? I’m not trying to attack Islam as a whole, I’m wondering if the media would have been so careful to not mention it if the situation were different.
I stand corrected. I guess he was doing this for religious reasons.
Now that I think about it, I’m a little surprised this hasn’t happened before. I mean, we’ve been at war in the Middle East for the better part of a decade.
Come on guys, isn’t it obvious he was doing this in the name of his religion? I’m not trying to attack Islam as a whole, I’m wondering if the media would have been so careful to not mention it if the situation were different.
I stand corrected. I guess he was doing this for religious reasons.
Now that I think about it, I’m a little surprised this hasn’t happened before. I mean, we’ve been at war in the Middle East for the better part of a decade.
There is evidence that Hassan, a devout Muslim, was quite pissed about the wars in the Middle East and was dead set against going there as part of his service. But does that mean his religion was a motivating factor in his killing spree?
Regardless what his reason for killing those folks was..he was nucking futs..
Yeah, but this guy was never in the Middle East and never saw combat. He was a psychiatrist. It’s not PTSD, so that kinda flushes that theory down the shitter.
My clinical training was at Atascadero State Hospital for the Criminally Insane..at that time 50 per cent of my patients were Vietnam Vets..lot’s of my co-workers nutted up and did stupid things..ya can’t walk through the pasture without getting shit on your shoes..
PTSD by proxy…which can be much worse.
It all sucks..
Come on guys, isn’t it obvious he was doing this in the name of his religion? I’m not trying to attack Islam as a whole, I’m wondering if the media would have been so careful to not mention it if the situation were different.
The main purpose of these religions is to keep people in line..the opiate of the masses and all that..sometimes it doesn’t work..
So having to hear about combat horrors was worse than living them? Are you kidding?
Working in an environment where people are in horrible pain day in and day out..does some pretty horrible things to people…I can say working in a hospital with crazy people..is probably comparable to combat..People screaming..trying to harm you..trying harm others..the crazy staff you have to work with..constantly being confronted with other humans having the most tragic lives imaginable..If you’ve been there..you know what I say is true..
You work in that environment for years..and you’re very lucky if you still have all your marbles..
What’s not being said is this didn’t happen in Britain or Japan..cause they don’t have as many guns available…There’s crazy folks everywhere.. the difference here is they have guns..
Let me direct you to a previous thread that has some fun look at these thoughts..
LOUISVILLE, Ky. — Ken Pagano, the pastor of the New Bethel Church here, is passionate about gun rights. He shoots regularly at the local firing range, and his sermon two weeks ago was on “God, Guns, Gospel and Geometry.” And on Saturday night, he is inviting his congregation of 150 and others to wear or carry their firearms into the sanctuary to “celebrate our rights as Americans!” as a promotional flier for the “open carry celebration” puts it.
If Jesus woulda had his glock with him when he went into the temple he would of mowed those Philistines down..
